Waiting for God
Friendo 18 comments
Here at Rusty Lime lately, there has been some turmoil over a subject that has been covered over and over at this URL. So many posts about Atheism and Religion. Mostly Pro Atheism and Con Religion. There have been and are still those readers and even contributors who fight back, and some writers who even buck the trend. Myself-I don't think anyone has any trouble figuring where I stand on the issue of god...I don't believe.
Being a native Oregonian, I was somewhat familiar with this story from the get go, though there was no story-other than a missing man-until May, 1995. The sign to the right actually marks the stretch of road in question.
Belos is the story from the pages of the New York Times.
Trapped in Snow in Oregon, Salesman Died After 9 Weeks
AGNESS, OR May 30— Dewitt Allan Finley spent the last nine weeks of his life snowbound in his pickup truck, drinking water from melted snow, checking off the days on his calendar and writing letters attesting to his faith in God. "He has met my needs daily, and I'm alive, well and comforted," Mr. Finley wrote in a letter to his boss, Elmer Sieler, which was found with his body. "I have no control over my life. It's all in His hands."
Mr. Finley, a 56-year-old man from Kalispell, MT, disappeared on Nov. 14 during a sales trip in Oregon for a Kalispell camper company. His body was found on May 20 in the Coast Range of southwest Oregon.
Mr. Finley, who had spent most of his life in the Los Angeles area, had worked in the Northwest for several months. His boss said that as a relative newcomer he lacked the survival skills of the area's longtime residents.
The Missoulian newspaper of Missoula, MT, carried an account on Monday of Mr. Finley's final days. The paper described the letters, written on sheets from a legal pad, to his fiancee, children, other relatives and Mr. Sieler. The letters were left in sealed, stamped envelopes.
Mr. Finley checked off nine weeks on his calendar. He had water from melted snow but no food, the newspaper said.
In the letters, Mr. Finley said he had decided to take a scenic route from Coos Bay to Grants Pass, following a forest road that parallels the Rogue River, a location for the 1994 movie "River Wild" that featured Meryl Streep.
In the letter to Mr. Sieler, Mr. Finley described how his pickup, which had a camper attached, slid off a icy, single-lane mountain road and he decided to stop for the night. A three-day storm left the truck stuck in deep snow. Rather than trying to hike some 18 miles to Agness, the last town he had passed, Mr. Finley apparently decided to wait for someone to come by. He had not told anyone which route he planned to follow.
"He believed his chance was best there," Mr. Sieler said in an interview with The Missoulian.
The company sent out another salesman to search for Mr. Finley, put up posters offering a $5,000 reward and hired an airplane to fly over the area where he had last been seen.
Although Mr. Finley had no propane to operate the camper's furnace, he warmed himself with the truck's heater and used cushions and a bedspread to make a bed on the bench seat of the four-wheel-drive truck. The truck still had half a tank of diesel fuel when found.
In the letter to Mr. Sieler, written after a month in the mountains, Mr. Finley expressed serenity and faith, and a belief that he would still be rescued.
"If not, I'll see you in Glory," he wrote. "I know God will bless you and yours."
Finley, a healthy man of 56, probably could have walked out pretty easily.
But he was a believer. Finley was convinced that God would save him. For nine weeks he sat in his truck, meticulously marking off the days, and writing in his diary.
In the spring they found his body. He'd starved to death in his truck.
Today it is pretty easy to say that Finley was foolish for doing what he did. He could have made other choices, better ones, and he might have saved himself. Source
To me, this story seems intensely interesting. What I wouldn't give to read Finley's diary. However, as I understand, the pages were turned over to his family, who have never been forth coming with these documents for public view. Heck, it might even make a good movie.
It's quite clear that if Dewitt had just ventured out a few hundred feet, he almost surely would have been able to make it to safety, or have been rescued. Apparently, god helps those who help themselves, but not those who wait on his help. Or was it that Dewitt Finley just didn't wait long enough?
This brings up a question: Would you have tried to walk out, or would you have waited?
Gina
Saturday 24th July 2010 | 09:48 PMYour question goes deeper than what's on the surface:
"Would you have tried to walk out, or would you have waited?"
What you really mean is, "Are you going to sit there and not do anything to save yourself or are you just going to sit there and pretend some God exists, you big dummy?"
As I recall, Friendo, it was Kathleen who got you the job in Mexico at the Montessori school, not you. You sat at home while she went and looked for work. And as I recall, when you were attacked in Mexico and left unconscious and bleeding to death, and it was again Kathleen who went and got you help. And afterward, you turned to your old "friend" for help. I'm not judging you, but think about it. You didn't try to walk out of any of those situations. Why? Because you were in no position literally or figuratively kept you back from being able to that? Doesn't matter, someone else who got you out. You didn't save yourself.
"It's quite clear that if Dewitt had just ventured out a few hundred feet, he almost surely would have been able to make it to safety, or have been rescued. "
Is it quite clear? Surely? I'm just amazed at your willingness to make a statement of faith about something you can't possibly know. Besides, it wasn't only a "few hundred feet." It says: "Rather than trying to hike some 18 miles to Agness, the last town he had passed, Mr. Finley apparently decided to wait for someone to come by."
He was 18 miles deep in the wilderness and snowB-O-U-N-D. And last time I checked 18 miles is more than a "few hundred feet."
Anyways, thanks for the rant.
Gina
Saturday 24th July 2010 | 09:56 PMCorrection: Because you were in no position literally or figuratively and that's what kept you back from being able to that? Doesn't matter, someone else got you out. You didn't save yourself.
Gina
Saturday 24th July 2010 | 10:16 PMThis might shed some light on whether or not Mr. Dewitt was smart to stay in his truck or not:
Kim family ordeal
Main article: James Kim
Bear Camp Road came into the national spotlight in late 2006 when James Kim, his wife Kati, and their two daughters attempted to reach Gold Beach via this route. They missed an Interstate 5 exit to their intended route, Oregon Route 42, and decided to take Bear Camp Road instead. Late on the night of November 25, 2006, they missed signs warning of possible snow and continued up the mountain road. At the intersection of the BLM and FS sections of the road, they accidentally turned off of Bear Camp Road and eventually ended up lost 15 miles (24 km) down an unpaved side road before stopping for the night. A snowstorm trapped them at this location.
The family waited for rescue, surviving on limited resources. After spending six days waiting for rescue, James Kim left the car to seek help. He and his wife had attempted to locate their position using area road maps, and had estimated that the small town of Galice, Oregon was only four miles away. They were actually 33 miles (53 km) from the town by road. [1]
He left the car at 7:30 a.m. on Saturday, December 2 and backtracked down the road on which they were stranded. Approximately 11 miles (18 km) down the road, he turned down into the Big Windy Creek canyon. James Kim hiked through treacherous and dangerous terrain to reach the creek, and apparently was attempting to follow it to the Rogue River in an attempt to find help. [2]
On the following Monday, searchers found Kati Kim and her children near the car, but could not locate James Kim. Searchers traced James Kim's path down Big Windy Creeks canyon in an effort to find him. His body was recovered in Big Windy Creek on Wednesday, December 6. According to medical examiners, James Kim died of hypothermia, but a precise time of death was not known.[1] He had walked approximately 16 miles (26 km) trying to find help. [3]
Initial reports from government officials contained incorrect information about the position of the Kims' car and its proximity to the location where James Kim's body was found. It was first thought that the Kims' car was stranded at the intersection to the access road for Black Bar Lodge (42°39′1.25″N 123°44′54.15″W / 42.6503472°N 123.748375°W / 42.6503472; -123.748375). They were actually six miles from this shelter. Mapping errors caused this miscalculation, according to officials.[3] The actual location was: 42°41′26″N 123°46′36″W / 42.690430°N 123.776577°W / 42.690430; -123.776577 (Actual Location of Kim's Stranded Car)
Following the conclusion of the search and recovery efforts, government officials confirmed that a gate blocking access to the road on which the Kims were stranded should have been locked, but was not. Bureau of Land Management employees dispatched to close the gate had decided against locking the gate due to the possibility of hunters being stranded inside.[4] [5] [6]
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bear_Camp_Road
gilly
Saturday 24th July 2010 | 10:59 PMI would have got out of the car
But thats not your question is it Friendo
You are asking if he was a Christian with so much faith why did he die
Thats a good question
I am sure there is a good answer but it wont be good enough for you
Papa
Sunday 25th July 2010 | 05:02 AMSeems like he is an idiot in the first place for going out into the wilderness without any rudimentary knowledge of survival skills. Surprised he didn't try to eat, or hunt. Oh well, he is with the Lord now...
...in response to this comment by T-Mac. Good to have you man...Fear not, as long as you behave, I won't expose you. I had a big long comment, but lost it when I forgot to open another tab. Crap...
I just gave you your first Kudo. I think you should get yourself a photo or avitar. Also, be sure to mention in your profile how much you love Rush, Glen Beck, and Sarah McPalin...You right wing wack;-)
Thanks for all the help with John Wayne Gacey...He's bustin' bugs.
f~
Gina
Sunday 25th July 2010 | 08:15 AM...in response to this comment by Papa. Papa, what was he supposed to hunt, and assuming there was something to hunt out there, how was he supposed to kill it? Maybe the guy was vegan. It sounds retarded, I realize that. "Well, screw that! If you're dying of hunger, you'll eat anything..." Obviously with all snow around, there wasn't a lot of vegetation. And besides, assuming this story is true entirely, death clearly doesn't scare some people the way it scares others. If it didn't, nobody would ever commit suicide.
What are you doing with the gun, by the way?
Papa...Yes, there seems that there is some sort of disconnect here, though he was not really in what I would call Wilderness, just a not so well traveled road.
Gilly...thanks for the comment, and you're right. I like to have facts, logic, and science.
Gina dear...I deliberately left out the Kim story, which was much more of a big deal out west, than was Finley. But since you've brought it up, interestingly-having died trying to save his innocent family. More of a man of action. Perhaps he just wasn't godly enough. Er, Perhaps Finley was just too zealous. Er...perhaps you will explain this to me. It looks to me like a solid case of "Damned if you do, damned if you don't"
And T Mac...I'll get back to you on that deep fried Jesus thing in the other thread.
Ya' gotta love it,
f~
Gina
Sunday 25th July 2010 | 08:50 AMI wouldn't dare speculate. Besides, I'm sure your mind is pretty much mad -- er, made up.
Papa
Sunday 25th July 2010 | 01:09 PM...in response to this comment by Friendo. True. We should rejoice that one more idiot is out of the gene pool...
Gina
Sunday 25th July 2010 | 03:23 PMI finally get it. How could I be so dense. Atheists are as dogmatic about idiots being taken out of the gene pool as Christians are about idiots going to a literal hell for eternity.
Different words.
Same nonsense.
Sick.
I'm outta here..............
gilly
Sunday 25th July 2010 | 07:42 PM...in response to this comment by Friendo. Yeah right Friendo
"facts, logic, and science". You say
So if it cant be quantified it doesnt exist, is that your implication
Careful I am setting you up here you know
Tony Fyler
Monday 26th July 2010 | 05:37 PMHmm...This is actually quite an interesting one. In such cases, I'd have to go with first getting a little thing we call situational awareness - at least within the scope of my abilities to determine it. I was in a town some 18 miles back, and there's been a fierce three day storm that's almost buried the car. Question 1 - does anyone know where I am, or where I'm supposed to be? Question 2 - will my non-appearance anywhere raise flags with anyone? Question 3 - do I have a means of contacting anyone? If the answers to all three of these are positive, sit tight and drink snow. If the answers to any one of them is negative, go outside and scout the area. If it looks like there's nothing within easy walking distance, get the bedspread, wrap up the cushions and anything else that might prove useful for a longer hike, put on every piece of clothing I have with me and head out, sticking to the road I've driven down. 18 miles is a fair walk, but it's well within a human span - and without a food source in the vehicle, every day you wait makes you weaker and less able to survive the trip. As the other case that Gina cited makes plain, there's no guaranteed survival option, but using an information-based decision-making paradigm surely has to be the way to go (NB this doesn't necessarily argue in favour of the long hike - only if there's no particular likelihood of rescue does this become the favoured option).
Henk V
Monday 26th July 2010 | 07:12 PMIf it cant be quantified Goldilocks... it doesnt exist.
get off your tree, absence of evidence is absence of evidence and is a predictiction. Religion has run our of prediction.
Science is nature, science measures everything, even the absurd way you believe in an absurd being.
Argue an absurd being? well ask baby bear how stupid he looks every time he tries...
louise
Thursday 29th July 2010 | 09:00 AM...in response to this comment by T-Mac. But this man had faith, obviously. It didn't do him any good though.
T-Mac
Thursday 29th July 2010 | 09:50 AMFaith doesn't relive you of effort or gaurantee your prayers will be answered
often the stronger your faith the harder yo are tested
ironically we often don't have our prayed answered
"Thank God for unanswered prayers"
...in response to this comment by T-Mac. thanks Garth...
f~
T-Mac
Saturday 24th July 2010 | 09:17 PMTough call many instructors teach when lost staying put is often a good strtategy, personally I would have stayed put a day or two then attempted to hike out.
I would have prayed for the strenght and judgement for success either way.
My belief is God will often give us the tools and opportunity for success in life and leaves it to us to find our way.
Win or Lose faith is what helps me perservere.